View Full Version : Virgin Media UK Begins Throttling P2P / Newsgroup Traffic 5:00pm until Midnight.
Virgin Media UK Begins Throttling P2P / Newsgroup Traffic 5:00pm until Midnight on top of the current STM.
http://www.unitethecows.com/content/359-virgin-media-uk-begins-throttling-p2p-traffic.html
UK Internet Service Provider (ISP) Virgin Media has announced that it will begin throttling both P2P and Newsgroup traffic at "Peak" times it has emerged.
The ISP which advertises itself as "The fastest in the UK" and offers speeds of up to 100mb has said it needs to throttle file sharing traffic to prevent slowness in other areas such as online multiplayer gaming.
Trialing of the new traffic managment plans commenced on March 2 and will only apply to Upstream traffic, therefore download speeds will be unaffected. The clamp down will apply on top of the existing traffic shaping Virgin Media has in place and will affect all packages, including the previously unmanaged 100mb deal.
A message on the Virgin Media site read
"After the successful out of hours trial of our combined upstream and downstream file sharing traffic management policy we will be trialling this new policy between 17:00 and 00:00 for one week starting on Wednesday 2nd of March.
Between these times P2P and Newsgroup upstream traffic will be managed in a similar way to our current downstream traffic management. If the trial is successful we'll launch the new policy immediately.
We're interested if you could tell us how this affects your gaming experience over the next few days and if you see any general improvement in latency and ping at peak times."
The move comes as a surprise to many as Virgin already manage traffic between 4pm and 8pm. Virgin Medias website details their file sharing traffic management policy and says;
"We moderate the total volume of file sharing traffic on our network between 5pm and midnight on weekdays and midday and midnight on weekends. This policy, which applies to all broadband packages, is restricted to Peer to Peer ("P2P") applications and Newsgroups (which are commonly used to distribute large amounts of data). This policy does not impact any applications other than Peer to Peer and Newsgroups, so things like watching iPlayer, online gaming, making calls via Skype, downloading music tracks from iTunes or streaming them from Spotify and sending an email or normal browsing are unaffected."
So there you have it, Virgin Media ARE the UK's fasstest Broadband Provider, but only because they decided what you can do and when you can do it.
Nice to read this in the news and not in a newsletter or e-mail or anything to any of their existing customers (like me) :p
No surprise at all tbh, I just wish companies would be completely honest and open, and actually told their customers (existing and potential) a straight story.
It won't actually concern me much tbh, I might get narked off if for example WoW updates are throttled when I'm trying to update of an evening - but then there's always other sources of those updates via plain old http :)
Tbh, if you are genuinally torrenting a large amount of data (the main use for torrents), then chances are you're already prepared to wait a while for it, so delaying that until the quiet hours seems okay to me.
Or maybe I just got old :D
Sniperdude
09-03-11, 01:03
this is old news they have been throttling P2P and usenet for months now ?
this is old news they have been throttling P2P and usenet for months now ?
This is separate to the current P2P and Newsgroup STM and has only just been added to throttle speeds regardless of the amount you have downloaded between 5:00pm and midnight and even now Throttles 50mb that was exempt from any STM before 2nd of March.
I'm on 50mb and i'm now unable to download from Virginmedia newsgroup any faster than 25Mbps but as soon as it hits Midnight i'm backup too 50Mbps.
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"Upstream P2P Traffic Management Peak Time Trial - 2nd March"
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Announcements/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Peak-Time-Trial-2nd-March/m-p/371275
Posted on 8 Mar 2011 at 08:42
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/broadband/365782/virgin-upstream-throttling-angers-gamers
Gamers complaints
“We'd like to hear your feedback about how this affects your broadband connection and if this has any affect on your gaming experience online," Virgin said.
Gamers were certainly quick to take the company up on its suggestion, with a number of gamers posting about negative impacts on their services.
"I'm playing Rift and the game was fine, with no latency problems, then all of a sudden my game starts lagging out and nothing working," posted customer Del528 on a thread stretching over pages and featuring largely negative responses.
"I looked at my latency in game and it was varying from 560ms to 15,000ms, same again today. Is it a coincidence this is happening at the same time you start your trial? I don't think so. I pay money for a service from yourselves and you're failing."
Virgin Media later posted a response saying Rift traffic had been affected and was subsequently whitelisted, but complaints persisted about World of Warcraft.
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Sniperdude
09-03-11, 02:17
big deal.. they give us a free upgrade a few weeks go.. so happy days :thumb:
this only effects people downloading off P2P and actually uploading anyway as Usenet dont upload unless your an errr uploader
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Announcements/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Peak-Time-Trial-2nd-March/td-p/371275
Didn't Icetea start a thread on this?
If they're going to cap P2P uploads on port then they'll have a problem. Would likely need to use a mean old proxy filter for it.
Question is how badly is the throttling like? Say 5mbps upload down to what?
Sounds to me like they won't be much point of upgrading to 100mbps when 10 mbps upload will get throttled during peak hours.
Threads Merged & cleaned up.
If they're going to cap P2P uploads on port then they'll have a problem. Would likely need to use a mean old proxy filter for it.
They use deep packet inspection to read the headers of the packets to see what they are intended for regardless of TCP or UDP port.
Some P2P clients attempt to use obfuscation but it's questionable how effective this is and the DPI equipment ruleset are always being updated.
Threads Merged & cleaned up.
Thanks Tystar but you removed the links i had to more information at http://community.virginmedia.com
If you could replace them that would be great :)
Thanks Tystar but you removed the links i had to more information at http://community.virginmedia.com
If you could replace them that would be great :)
Sorted
Sorted
Thanks :)
Question is how badly is the throttling like? Say 5mbps upload down to what?
Sounds to me like they won't be much point of upgrading to 100mbps when 10 mbps upload will get throttled during peak hours.
Irony is they say this forced throttling is to help gaming but this new traffic Management that started a few days ago has already caused a problem with RIFT and WOW
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/broadband/365782/virgin-upstream-throttling-angers-gamers
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Gaming/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Trial-Feeback-Latency-and-Ping/m-p/372863
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/General-broadband-questions/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Trial-Feeback/td-p/372857
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no problem with BFBC2 or SupCom2, so im happy :)
i limit my downloads through download manager anyway, plus i got QoS on my router to ensure gaming computer gets best connection.
as long as they are not affecting the gaming ping, throttle speeds is fine. only those buying 50 or 100Mbps epeen people will really care about speeds.
Good. The speeds in my area are chronic at those times, upload just dies and it's bad all day.
Irony is they say this forced throttling is to help gaming but this new traffic Management that started a few days ago has already caused a problem with RIFT and WOW
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/broadband/365782/virgin-upstream-throttling-angers-gamers
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Gaming/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Trial-Feeback-Latency-and-Ping/m-p/372863
http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/General-broadband-questions/Upstream-P2P-Traffic-Management-Trial-Feeback/td-p/372857
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Not good. The cheap skates should invest in their network instead of throttling everyone.
But then how is a poor little media company supposed to make any money if they always have to make investments?
The shareholders, the shareholders, wont somebody please think of the shareholders!
iGoD ReLeNtLeS
09-03-11, 11:12
you can see whats coming next... encrypted P2P networks :knock:
you can see whats coming next... encrypted P2P networks :knock:
next???
:rofl:
redrooster303
09-03-11, 11:26
I've got BT infinity and thats bad on an evening. I'm supposed to get 40mb/s (I get 37mb/s normally) and it goes down to 2mb/s sometimes less.
I think they should only limit the people that are actually doing the mega down/up loading.
I think they should only limit the people that are actually doing the mega down/up loading.
like Virgin's traffic management program.
i actually quite like that program, now that i've got my NAS box setup to stop downloading during that period. never had a bad ping during evening gaming, speed is always fast.
redrooster303
09-03-11, 11:37
I'm not that knowledgable on all this but it seems bt just limits everyone, if virgin only limits the really bad up/downloaders then I might just switch to them. I'm sick of just wanting to up/download something in the evening only for it to go at 40kb/s.
In all honesty I don't think they should manage anyone because we all pay for what we use. Even the mega massive downloaders have paid.
It will come to a point where there is nothing thats not capped and it will spoil everything, if one company gets away with it all the companies jump on the bandwagon.
Throttling is hardly new. They all do it and it is targeted at the people who download/upload many gigs in the peak times.
Personally I'm not too fussed so long as I have a good ping for gaming. Massive downloads can run overnight.
I'm not that knowledgable on all this but it seems bt just limits everyone, if virgin only limits the really bad up/downloaders then I might just switch to them. I'm sick of just wanting to up/download something in the evening only for it to go at 40kb/s.
In all honesty I don't think they should manage anyone because we all pay for what we use. Even the mega massive downloaders have paid.
It will come to a point where there is nothing thats not capped and it will spoil everything, if one company gets away with it all the companies jump on the bandwagon.
They impose certain download amount, then exceed it then boom throttled till midnight. They don't impose download limits on 50mbps connection presently or 100mbps.
Sniperdude
09-03-11, 13:59
Question is how badly is the throttling like? Say 5mbps upload down to what?
Sounds to me like they won't be much point of upgrading to 100mbps when 10 mbps upload will get throttled during peak hours.
I have 50Mb normally can download at 6MBps from p2p and usenet
in the peak hours this is throttled to 3.5 MBps
using ssl on port 433 (usenet) I am not throttled at all.
All the same I have set up my server so anything I do tell it to download doesn't start till 12am
everything else works at normal speed other than p2p and usenet.
I have 50Mb normally can download at 6MBps from p2p and usenet
in the peak hours this is throttled to 3.5 MBps
using ssl on port 433 (usenet) I am not throttled at all.
All the same I have set up my server so anything I do tell it to download doesn't start till 12am
everything else works at normal speed other than p2p and usenet.
Sucks, 100Mb affected too?
ArthurHucksake
09-03-11, 15:01
People will wise up, soon start their heavy downloading before they goto work and cause more of a strain on the network than they would have done previously. Then what are they going to do?
Don't be a broadband provider if you don't want to provide broadband. lol
I lived in a house with 6 people and they all had torrents going 24/7 meaning we were constantly throttled. I told them to schedule them but I got a blank stare. In the end I had to enforce draconian QoS measures and ban P2P during the day.
In my experience. People don't care.
I lived in a house with 6 people and they all had torrents going 24/7 meaning we were constantly throttled. I told them to schedule them but I got a blank stare. In the end I had to enforce draconian QoS measures and ban P2P during the day.
In my experience. People don't care.
Yeah pretty much the motto now a days :thumb:
Sniperdude
09-03-11, 15:59
I personally am not bothered about the p2p and Usenet throttle even with added upload throttle as ( it was worrying at first but after a few weeks it don't bother me I don't download much anyway )
But it do think virgin need to upgrade its network and put everyone on Docsis 3 and get the hacked modems off the network.
Annoying on an unlimited service like mine but shouldn't affect me much... I hope.
I personally am not bothered about the p2p and Usenet throttle ( it was worrying at first but after a few weeks it don't bother me I don't download much anyway )
But it do think virgin need to upgrade its network and put everyone on Docsis 3 and get the hacked modems off the network.
Yeah tends be ex employee's who know how to bypass the security with modded modems.
Does Docsis 3 prevent you from hacking a modem to work on the network?
Yep they already throttled o2p but never been a problem since encrypted what I downloading via settings in programs of using Tor.
Does Docsis 3 prevent you from hacking a modem to work on the network?
Nar they still get around it, but DOCSIS 3 let's them use all available bandwidth channels more efficiently than older DOCSIS protocols :thumb:
You know I think when the engineers were installing my new modem for the 30Mb upgrade the older guy was saying he had a "special modem" for the younger one.
Slightly sus...
You know I think when the engineers were installing my new modem for the 30Mb upgrade the older guy was saying he had a "special modem" for the younger one.
Slightly sus...
Yeah, virgin network engineers know system inside an out so when comes to bypassing the security measures they are unfortunately miles ahead of the game.
i wont leave o2 until the start throttling me in peak times been with them over a year never had any speed issue
My connection is quite bad as of today an yesterday
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195069820.png
It's usually 50Mbps an 1.6Mbps upload
Sniperdude
10-03-11, 22:20
My connection is quite bad as of today an yesterday
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195069820.png
It's usually 50Mbps an 1.6Mbps upload
use pingtest see if your losing packets
Bad result said couldn't test packet loss seem to time out
http://www.pingtest.net/result/36560703.png (http://www.pingtest.net)
i get this
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195147567.png
Sniperdude
10-03-11, 23:21
i get this
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195147567.png
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195171536.png
OWNED :chairfall: my ping test grades my line as B
i get this
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1195147567.png
Yeah i usually get around that slightly higher on download usually, atm though connection is up an down went fully off yesterday for few hours came back at snails pace now is ok for awhile then bad again. Guess they preparing my area for upload increase since power levels have altered drastically from what they once was.
redrooster303
11-03-11, 00:37
BT had a fair use policy of 100gb per month and then they upped it to 300gb pm (on infinity anyway, don't know about the others).
What they've done now is all the people on infinity have true unlimited meaning they have now scrapped the fair use policy.
They have however increased the throttling managment but where I read this didn't say what was going to be new about there throttling managment.
BurningFeetMan
11-03-11, 10:23
Surely eventually the equipment will be able to deal with whatever users can throw at it and they can get rid of stm throttling etc? Or is that wishful thinking lol.
For those heavily into downloading I'm sure they are already using a seedbox and transferring via http to bypass the throttling side of things.
I don't blame vm for what they are doing, but would much have preferred the removal of all this stm over free speed upgrades and 100mb lines. As a residential customer can you make use of 100mb without tripping stm? It seems a bit of an odd package to me.
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